New readers will want to refer to my recently update article on Why I Left the Philippines.
A reader, (thanks, Sam), left a couple great comments, full of questions that many people aside from him want to know, so decided to make another article out of it.
Also, in case anyone has been living under a rock, you already know that we have a new President-Elect here in the Philippines, Mr. "Noynoy" Aquino. Many of the provisions we currently rely on under the Balik Bayan Privilege program are not part of the law itself, but are administered under Executive Orders issued by the outgoing President, Ms. Gloria Arroyo.
Executive orders do not automatically cancel themselves when a president leaves office, but a new president often "cleans house" quite early in his/her term. I have no knowledge of, not even heard any rumors of, changes Mr. Aquino may make after he assumes office … but I’m just bringing the issue up to encourage people to be aware over the next few months … significant changes might be in the offing.
Anyway, without further ado, let’s get on to Sam’s questions, shall we?
… However, there are two things that wondering me about your situation, if I understand/read it well which are-
(1) Why airline clerk at Macau airport refused you to board at first when you have had a US passport? I mean, regardless of your marriage to a Filipina or previous stay in the PH, airlines can take you to PH because as a US citizen you could have allowed 21 days stay with or without your wife accompanied with you. Then why clerk refused you to board on a plane? Is there something I’m missing in your story or didn’t read it well? I mean, it was not like that airline was taking someone who shouldn’t have been taken to the PH because you are allowed to go to the PH without any visa or without your Filipino spouse anyway being a US citizen then why airline clerk stopped you at first?
Sam, the reason the airline initially did not want to board me was a very common one. I had no evidence of "follow-on" or return travel within 21 days of my projected arrival in the Philippines. Philippine law requires that airlines enforce this rule. There’s a tremendous amount of argument and contention that circulates around this issue, including more stories than you can shake a stick at regarding folks who did not have onward travel confirmed … but the fact and the law remains … to board a plane to the Philippines with no Philippine visa in your passport, you must have onward travel (back home or on to another country). One legal exception is, as happened with my wife and I, if the foreigner is accompanied by his Filipino or former-Filipino spouse, and otherwise eligible to use the Balikbayan Privilege program, then the airline may carry you … which they did.
(2) I’m greatly curious as to why you have not applied for immigrant visa (13a) so far given how dearly you love living in the PH given your length of stay in the PH. I mean, I see you have suggested to some to get this immigrant visa than going thru all the hassle and more expensive route of extending stay. I’m sure you have your reason for not having applied for this visa which you don’t have tell if you don’t want but I’m very curious as to why you didn’t obtain this visa for yourself.
Number One, most honest answer? I’m lazy.
Number Iwo answer? I’m cheap. Zero Pesos is the lowest fee I know of, and that is what a balikbayan stamp currently costs.
Number Three answer? Any time I can avoid setting foot inside a Bureau of Immigration facility, I do. Read my blogging colleague Claudette’s account of getting a 13(a) visa for her husband. And remember, she’s not only Filipino but a legal professional and a fellow government employee with the folks whose behavior she comments on.
Eventually, I’ll get a 13(a) visa. But, under the present conditions, I see no reason to. By all means, if you are still in the USA, I recommend you get the resident visa through the Philippine Embassy or the Consulate which serves you state of residence. I had every intention of doing it this way myself, when we moved to the Philippines in 2006 … but personal issues and time requirements came together in a way that didn’t work out for me.
(3) Can you please tell me the advantages and disadvantages of obtaining immigrant visa (13a)? I’m a US citizen, married with a green card hold Filipina wife, living together in NY, who visited very first time to the Philippines two months ago with my wife and completely fell in love with PH. I’m planning to visit PH again in this December for at least 5 months but I will not be arriving to the PH with my wife because I’ll be going there from another country while she will go there from NY. So I know that me going there alone means obtaining only 21 days unless I obtain tourist visa and then usual extension until its enternity which might make me bankrupt…lols. Thus, I’m contemplating to obtain this immigrant visa. Any info, procedure and any other information about this visa will help.
Well, I’ve written at least a dozen articles that touch on this issue in one way or another … try the search box in the right-hand column for more info, or look at the related articles list at the bottom of this page.
There are advantages to the Balikbayan privilege stamp and advantages to getting a permanent resident visa, but most of those advantages are not chiseled in stone. Even for the same couple under different situations, sometimes a 13(a) or 13(g) visa is best, sometimes a BB Stamp is much better, easier and cheaper.
My wife and I travel at least once a year. We (so far), always travel together. So for us, at this stage of our life, and under the present rules of the BB program, it’s best for us. It’s not the best deal for everyone, though, as you point out … if you need to travel without your spouse an BB solution doesn’t work at all.
So which one is best? As we like to say here in the Philippines, " ‘Sup to you". Use the legal method that works for you at the time, and run with it .. don’t over analyze the issue. If you have to change to a different method later, fine … I used to wear skinny, shiny double-knit pants, but I changed to loose, relaxed Docker’s look and feel and they now suit me better.
Could you please tell me what kinds of fees I should expect in the PH, at BI office and at the airport at the time departure, if I would be an immigrant visa (13a) holder and would leave the PH after 5 months of stay? I have heard of the requirement of everyone to have ACR-I card now if one would be staying in there for more than 59 days. And, I also know that immigrants are required to pay exit fees and might other fees as well which I’m not sure of.
photo credit: Rob the moment
If you come to the Philippines with a 13-series visa in your passport … as we have pretty much decided in this discus
sion is the best for you and tour wife at this moment, you will likely have to visit a BI office upon arrival. You’ll get instructed on your requirements by the Philippines Embassy before you leave the States. Will you have to pay them anything upon arrival? No, so far as I know.
When you leave after 5 months, probably the only thing you have to pay for is the standard 500 or 600 Peso Airport Security fee … Us passport holder … or Green Card holders too, are exempt from Travel Tax for stays of less than one year. Your ACR-I card takes care of other items like exit fees and such.
Now one or two other thoughts to wind up the article here.
There’s a very easy way for you and your wife to legally enter the Philippines free under the Balik Bayan Privilege program. Coordinate your travel so you meet in Hong Kong or Macau or Singapore, and then take a cheap flight to the Philippines together … just as my wife and I did from Macau. Might not be doable, but it’s a thought.
Second, you mentioned that your wife is a US LPR (Legal Permanent Resident … i.e. Green Card). Take care that she doesn’t stay too long outside the US. Although the law says she can stay away as long as one year, Filipinos have regularly reported being hassled by US Immigration over stays outside the US as short as 6 months. Also, the time she stays outside the US is not credited to her required three-year residency in the IS while married to a US citizen for her naturalization … which ought to be the goal of every Phil-Am couple in my view … makes life a lot simpler.
Godspeed.
Popularity: 22% [?]
Thanks Dave for the detailed and helpful response, which is much appreciated than you know.
Now it’s quite clear as to why the airline clerk had intially stopped you at the Maccau airport from boarding a plane. I was actually fully aware of the requirement of having a return ticket for onward travel but didn’t know about your situation or the fact that – (1) you didn’t have return ticket and (2) that a return ticket or anything about onward travel is not required to get BB stamp/privilege. So it is very nice to know this important info.
As for what kinds of fees and taxes an immigrant visa holder (such as 13(a)) will be paying at the time of departing from the PH then I’m told that- (1) Exit Clearence Fee= 2800p; and (2) Departure tax which is now 750p. And you are right about not paying any travel tax if someone is a US citizen or LPR of the United States. I’m told all this about by 3 different folks like yourself who live in the PH for years and have been helping others thru their blogs. They didn’t talk anything about airport security fees that you have mentioned about. Is this Airport Security Fees is something different than what they have mentioned?
You are totally right, Dave, that the best economical way for me and wife is just go to the PH together so that I could get BB stamp for a year BUT it’s seemed kinda hard. Why? Because I normally visit to India from October to December each year, and all my future trips to PH will be from India from December to May. I’m in a business (online trading) that I can do from anywhere, but my wife works and she cannot and doesn’t get more 2 weeks’ vacation in a year. We spend 4-5 days pretty much in traveling from US to PH because it’s hard for us to get a best price for an airline ticket for traveling on Friday and weekends. That means, we don’t travel during Fridays and weekends, which is kinda bummer because we lose 6 days out of 14 days because of Fridays and weekends. By mentioning all this I just wanted to explain that it would be extremely difficult for my wife to meet me in India or other country so that we could travel together to PH afterwards. I mean, it’s possible but extremely difficult for her given the 14 days vacation.
But I completely understand what you mean. We will see if this could be done especially when it would be much cheaper for her to go to PH via India during December than going to PH directly from NY. It costs only $400-$550 for a roundtrip airline ticket from India to PH which is in the month of December when price gets skyhigh. And, I normally get a roundript ticket from NY to India for $800 for the month of October. Thus, we would still be paying much lower priced for an airline ticket if we take a fly to PH from somewhere there in Asia than flying directly from US.
My wife is due to file her naturalization application next year in June. That’s why she cannot be with me all the time out of the country. Besides, she has gone to PH only once in last 20 years which is also for 11 days. So, no worry about her abandoning her LPR in the States. We are waiting for her to be naturalized so that we could live in the PH without worrying about losing her LPR status in the US.
By the way, when you say ACR-i will take care of other fees then do you mean ACR covers exit clearance fees?
I’m now digging out your other articles from their graves on this matter…lols…
Thanks Dave for the good job you do…God Bless you and your family….
Hello SAM,
On the fees at departure, this is the latest I have:
Manila NAIA and Cebu Mactan fees
International departure: PHP 750
Domestic departure: PHP 200
Clark International Airport
International departure: PHP 600
Domestic departure: PHP 200
Everyone pays these. It’s an airport security fee.
There is also an government-imposed Travel Tax. Instead of asking me or anyone else who might or might not know … remember the longer someone has lived here, the less s/he knows about day-to-day travel at the airports … see this link. It explains Travel tax better than anyone else I have seen online:
http://www.philtourism.com/ttax.html
And it is written by the people who impose/control the tax.
Balikbayan don’t pay any other fee … like the ECC Exit Certificate. ACR-I card holder don’t either (or, more appropriately, the ECC fee is included n the cost of the ACR-I. Tourists pay this fee after, I believe, 60 days.
I get what you are saying about your wife meeting you in India. After eleven years away from home, I don’t think the measly difference between a discount for Thursday departure is worth losing 3 whole days of vacation, but hey, it’s your money. I only suggested Hong Kong originally because Hong Kong typically has good discount fares from the US. I never thought of going round the world the other way …the main point being, if you arrive together you can get the Balikbayan privilege, if you don’t, you can’t.
Anyway, hope this all works out for you, and best wishes fto your wife on here naturalization journey. It is sometimes along row to hoe .. there were times when myy wive and I felt we couldn’t stand it another day in the US, waiting, waiting, waiting … butt it’s well worth it now for her to have the “Blue passport”.
Godspeed.
“Us passport holder … or Green Card holders too, are exempt from Travel Tax for stays of less than one year”
Dave, I don’t see anywhere that saying about exception of travel tax to US passport holder. It does state about exception to US green card holders, Balik Bayan, someone who is in US Military or whose ticket is financed by US govt. I got all this info from the link that you provided, unless I have missed reading something there-
http://www.philtourism.com/ttax.html
Can you please look into it? And I completely understand that one must need to be in periodically touch with all these new updates on fees and requirements that take place there to have updated information on all this, and its not that easy for someone who doesn’t have to deal with all this issues on a daily basis. Yet still I would prefer to know your insight on it.
Thanks.
Hi SAM,
Please see: http://www.philtourism.com/ttax_what1.html
Now you have me so confused that I really don’t know what question I am asking. Yes it doesn’t say specifically that US Passport holders are exempt .. it says that non-immigrant aliens are exempt, when their stay is under one year … which includes US Passport holders and the passport holders of the other 100 plus countries that the Philippines recognizes without restriction.
It seems to me that you are a guy very interested in every detail of the very last detail, crossing the ‘t’s and ‘dotting the ‘i’s with great precision . This is great … but it’s not for me.
All these fees and questions are what will happen _after_ you come here. Occasionally laws change. Much more than occasionally, individual Immigration and taxation desk employees apply the law in ways that they didn’t to the last guy who went through the line.
Read some of my articles and comments to them about situations where two US passport holders go through Immigration together and one gets 14 more days stay than the other … or more than one instance where foreign guys just showed up at Immigration with their marriage certificate and got a BB stamp without their spouse present.
You want exact answers, but “exact” or “predictable” is not the way things happen here, I could say “Shit Happens” or maybe I should be more polite and say “Anomalies Occur”, but that sounds too pompous, so I’ll just conclude with YMMV (you can look it up on Google) Be well.
Quick question for you Dave,
Planning on going over this year on the Balikbayan with my wife to retire. My plan is to make sure I like it there and give it a 3 year test before I look at a 13a.
The question is; Can I open up a bank account there without an ACR-I card and just use the BB stamp in my passport?
I don’t know if 3 years is enough to ‘know’. I almost went home at 3 years. My friend Mindanao Bob suggests something like a 5 year commitment before you come and I tend to agree with him.
Where is your wife in all this? Do you think it is you who will have the most trouble adjusting? In my experience, including my own, personally, it’s the wife who has a lot more trouble adjusting … especially with family issues .. as she returns as a rich celebrity with a rich Kano hubbie. And when she has to keep house and cook with the way tings are here. Better make sure you talk tgs through with her.
As SAM already mentioned, thanks SAM, you either can or can’t get a bank account without an ACR-I card. I did, have had one for 4 years now, never had an ACR-I.
However, many banks demand one. Some (certainly not all) LTO’s (driver’s license) have been know to also.
On a tourist visa, you can now get an ACR-I card … matter of fact you are required to after 60 days. As a Balikbayan? I don’t know, never tried.
I also have cautioned several time slately, the rules for the Balikbayan program may (stress on may) change radically … most of the way the present program is applied comes from Executive Orders of the outhoing president. We have a new president coming in and he is known, among other things, to be more isolationist than PGMA, and to want to undo everything she did, just to show power. So who knows … I sure don’t, and those who ‘speak with authority’ on this are whistling in the wind, because many things may change.
If I were in your shoes, I would get my permanent visa there in the US before you come and solve the whole issue. The only reason I didn’t come on a permanent visa myself had to do with scheduling problems in the months before we moved … but having a permanent visa and the ACR-I preferable to any other method in the long run.
In the short run, just come on a BB stamp, it’s worked fine for me for more than three years now.
Either way will work.
Hello Danny,
I know you have specifically asked for Dave to get his insight and I’m sure he will chime in but I feel I should share my opinions as well on this question especially when I found the answer to it while doing extensive search online for a while, When I say about extensive search then I really meant it.
As to whether a particuluar bank in the PH will be able to open an account for a foreigner with just BB stamp then nobody can assure you for sure on it if a bank will allow you or not. Each bank, even each of their branch, works differently. Some banks have been reported to have refused some foreigners from opening an account without ACR-i card but then those same banks are reported to have opened account for some foreigners without ACR-I. However, the truth is- most banks in the PH will not open an account for someone who will not show to them ACR-i. Someone reported on a net a year ago that HSBC bank did open an account without ACR-i.
My research on dealing with various issues in the PH suggests me that money and/or a bit of luck work better in the PH than any laws/regulations in the books. Good luck.
Dave,
Someone has told me that if an immigrant visa holder would stay outside the PH more than 6 months then s/he would automatically lose his/her Permanent Resident Status in the PH which is same to US permanent residency which a LPR loses automatically while staying at abroad for one year continueously. Have you heard anything or know anything about it, Dave? This is the MOST important matter to me given the fact that I’m contemptating to apply for immigrant visa (13a) very soon but then I have no plan whatsoever to stay in the PH more than 4-5 months in a given year at most. I plan on being in the PH from middle of December til middle of May of each year in any given situation. Neither my Filipina wife has any plan as of now to live permanently in the US. She has a very good job in NY and she doesn’t see living in the PH anytime soon. Its me who is pushing to obtain this immigrant visa so that I could stay in the PH during those months without the hassle of frequent visits to BI and paying those hefty fees. But if there is indeed such requirement then I will be thinking twice about applying this immigrant visa for myself. Please share your views. Thanks Dave.
I know of no regulation/law that says you can’t be outside the Philippines more than 6 months. So far as I know, and I don’t know much, the law is very similar to US law, where you legally can stay away one year, up to two years with a re-entry permit obtained in advance. But I have no authoritative source.
Alos, akin to the US rukles, have there pbeen Philippine Permanant visa holders who have been hassled becuase they stayed away for long periods? Yep. Just as there have been Filipino Green Card holders who have been hassled returning to the US afyter 5 or 6 months away.
Each country places an inordinate about of discretionary powers with their Immigration Offciers … me, ‘tjose other people’, nor anyome else can say for sure what will happen when you come to an Immigration wicket.
But so far as I know, the Philippines considers 1 year or more away from the Philippines as “abandonment” of the visa.
Perhaps I never mentioned this before, but I should have. The Bureau of Immigration has a very useful and responsive “Help Desk” that gives answers to questions like this … also, many of the rules and procedures are on the BI web site, often spelled out ion some detail.
Bureau of Immigration, Philippines
Fill up the form or call:
Bureau of Immigration National Operations Center (BINOC)
+632 524-3769
1-800-100- ALIEN (24/7 Toll Free)Foe email, use their contact us page at:
http://immigration.gov.ph/index.php?option=com_contact&task=view&contact_id=1&Itemid=92
or direct to:
xinfo@immigration.gov.ph
Hope some of this will help.
Thanks Dave for the input and those links to BI. I have known about that “help desk” and did write them a few times in last 5 weeks but I’m still waiting for their response despite of writing to them a few times.. I did mention all this to the Consul at PH consulate in NY that I’ve written to BI many times but haven’t got any response yet. I’m told that I can write to Philippine consulate to get a confirmation on any matter related to BI and then they will contact BI in the PH thru Philippine External Affair office. And this way, a right information could be provided without any those inconsistent information.
Sorry your response hasn’t been as fast as mine. I haven’t been in contact with those folks for a while now, perhaps their workload increased, or they had someone who cared in charge who has since moved on. That’s always the problem when you try to pin all these issues down precisely .. things always seem to vary. Godspeed.
Hello Sam and thanks Dave for both your inputs…..
I have made the decision to get the 13a while in the States. That way it will solve all the current and future concerns. I do have one more question if you can answer……
After obtaining the 13a in the states, do you know how long you can have it while you are in the states before I use it when going over to the RP? Is there and expiry date after the passport is stamped to be used to enter the RP. Also, Do you need an ongoing ticket when using the 13a or can I get a one-way ticket?
Again, thank you both for your advises…
Denny
I _think_ the 13a has to be used the first time in something like 90 days. Things change in this business. I would contact the Embassy or the Consulate where you are going to gte the visa for their requirements on this.
You do not need onward travel with the 13a stamped din your passport. A one-way ticket is fine.
Danny, if you know about my situation by reading some of my postings then you must have known that I’m a US citizen married to a Filipina and right now living in NYC who is doing an extensive rearch on all these issues for a while as I’m also contemplating to get this immigrant visa 13a. I had the very same question that you have asked here which is-how long the immigrant visa would be good to use it first time after obtaining it from abroad. I mean, I want to apply for this visa now at Philippine consulate in NYC but I wouldn’t be traveling to the PH until Christmas of this year. So I called to 3 different PH Consulates in the US to get a consistent information; otherwise you know how many versions of tales you get when dealing anything with PH…lols. I contacted PH consulates in NYC, Chicago and San Fransico. All told me that immigrant visa is good for one year from the date of issuance. That means, you would have one full year to go to PH after issuing of this visa.
Further. I was also told by PH consulate in NYC that they issue this immigrant visa 13a on the same day by 4pm if application is submitted before noon so long all papers are in order, which did surprise me because I was under the impression that it will take at least 1-2 months. I was also told that no document is needed to notarized except medical report if both parties will be appearing in person at the PH consulate. And one very interesting information that I got from the this visa section in-charge that- an authentication of marriage is done for those who are in the PH but if someone is already here in the US then there is no need to authenticate the marriage certificate; instead they require the marriage to be reported on a prescribed form as delayed-reporting. This prescribed form is required to be filled out in 4 copies. Two copies of it they will send to NSO in Manila, one will be kept by them, and the last one for applicants’ record after receiving the stamp.
By the way, I’m also told that immigrant visa holders can travel to the PH on a one way ticket. This requirement of having return ticket or ticket for an onward travel is not required for immigrant visa holders.
Hope this helps. Let me know when and all the documents that you would submit to get this visa. Good luck.
Great info, SAM, thanks. I knew the processing was relatively quick, but in by noon, out by 4 … wow. It does take months here in the Philippines, and usually winds up costing more,so ever so much better to get it while in the US for most folks.
You also touched on a very important issue. Your marriage certificate can be very important in the Philippines for some things you might want to do. A US or other foreign certificate iris worthless in the Philippines. Go to (you can easily do this my mail, my wife and I did),m th Embassy or the consulate that serves your state and register with the NSO. That certified copy of the marriage registration you get from the embassy will be very important sometime in your life here, and you can’t get it after you move … it’s kind of a Catch 22 .. don’t get caught.
You bet, Dave, when you say about registering mariage at PH consulate at abroad if folks are married outside the PH. By the way, I got all this info from these folks in PH Consulates across the US who are lifetime diplomat and make living dealing these issues days-in and days-out. I would also like to point it out a few things that I was told by the Consul-in-charge in PH Consulate in NYC which are as follow:
(1) It’s also advised to bring original and copies of the birth certificate of foreign spouse because many consular officers might demand for it.
(2) If foreign spouse has no whatsover visible source of income (like no bank account, no pension, no assets, no job, nothing pretty much), then s/he could submit an affidavit from his/her Filipino spouse stating that s/he would take care of foreign-spouse financially when foreign spouse would be in the PH. And if Filipino spouse doesn’t have anything going on then an affidavit from anyone in the PH will do the trick.
On two different blogs out there I read about a case wherein BI still granted an immigrant to a guy who went to interview with his wife with nothing to prove financial capacity. He stated that he was so sure that he would get denied and fell on the floor when approval letter came in the mail. He said that he got only $5 in his pocket which is what all he had. Neither his wife was working as they were living off on wife’s family support. The strange thing is- they didn’t submit any paperwork about financial support. I think he just got lucky even though he stated that interviewing immigration officer told him flat out that his marriage is fraud and that his wife is a liar…lols…I guess, things work strangely in that part of the world…I’m just loving this part of the world….:)
Yeah there are lots of interesting stories out there. I’m really a bit amused by some guys who get really bent out of shape abut the Philippines (sometimes) requiring some propf of fiscal responsibility. The somehow think the fact they are Americans automatically pays the bills. Oh well ….
By the way, Dave, have you considered obtaining this immigrant visa 13a for yourself from PH consulate in the US? I mean I’m sure you know well enough that not only its so cheap outside the PH but also hassle free. Plus, you could get it in 4 hours altogether. A permanent one than a probationary one. It bypasses numerous visits to BI if its done in the PH.
But in my personal opinion, being on a balikbayan visa is the best if you could enter into the PH each time with your wife.
I would be happy to get my 13(a) in the US, but I’d have to be in the US to do that, and based on past experience it’s going to be way many years from now before that happens again. We went this past February (2010) and I was sorry I went in many ways. Chances of another US trip any time soon are very slim.